Has the story so far been in line with what you though it would be?

While cruising the ABC forums and another Castle forum, I read complaints about the current story arc. The main complaint is that our characters are not acting in character and that they are being written inconsistently. What I notice about the majority of these commentators is that this is their first time watching a "will they/ won't they" type of show, and they are quick to blame the writing when the story does not go along with how fast they want the ship to move. If the ship is not moving or even if the ship is hitting rough patches, they attack the writers for making the characters behave inconsistently.

As I read their comments, I argued that the story is making perfect sense given the finale of last season and the premiere of this season. I said that besides this being the "season of secrets" this season is also the season of the holding pattern. It is the season where these two people have accepted "the enough for now" mentality to avoid dealing with their own demons. Thus even as back as October, I kind a knew how the story would play out. It is precisely because the characters have behave in a consistent manner that one can make predictions about how they would react to the unexpected challenge.

As early as last October, looking at some of my previous posts (on another forum) , I had this to say about the holding pattern and about Caskett in general.

Back then I said:

Quote :

They are currently in a holding pattern. Beckett has shown that she is softening with regards to Castle, but she has not made a move. From all the mixed signals she is sending, Castle is bound to be confused. She is showing her greater appreciation of him and is dropping hints about love, but all Castle really knows for sure is her clear words to him at the swings. She is not ready to be in a relationship up until she gets some closure in her mother's case.

Clearly that entire swing set conversation could have been taken in two ways by Castle -- lets just be friends or I do love you but I'm not ready. Castle believes in his heart that she meant the latter but his brain says is its the former. This is why he is proving and why he has stopped flirting with her. He is waiting for a clear signal from her that his heart is correct, and until he gets that signal he will not act.

Beckett knows where Castle stands, and she knows that she is in love with him. What I think is holding her back though is that she is conflicted over having to make a selfish-choice and her loyalty as a daughter to a dead parent. Does she choose to love Castle and in the process stop looking into her mother's case, or does she choose to honor the memory of her dead mother by solving her murder while in the process giving up her chance at happiness.

and

Quote :

Castle's is not really doing anything to show her that he cares. Yes. He made his declaration at the end of last season, but this season he is just waiting for something to happen... Yes, Beckett is showing her greater appreciation of Castle, but she too is waiting. Someone has to end it. Wouldn't it be fun for us an audience to see either Castle or Beckett decide to show the other by actions and words how they feel about the other. Wouldn't the show be better off if we saw one struggling with wanting more but have the other unable to reciprocate right away? Wouldn't it be fun to see them share with someone what is in their minds instead of guessing and reading all the subtext? Give us Castle and Beckett by the end of this season, and/or at least show us that they are unhappy with just being friends. Show us Castle struggling with the waiting. Have Beckett confide in someone that she wants Castle as a lover

My biggest problem with this season hasn't been the story - it's been the pacing. The filler episodes really dragged. I think the issue between them would have been better served being addressed a bit in each episode. Like, Cuffed was cute, but it didn't address any of the reasons why there might be tension there - just the tease at the end about the handcuffs. At least that time Castle noticed it. That reaction Beckett has when Castle shows her how he pet the do - Castle basically DOESN'T react - he runs. Then there's her jealosuy in Beholder AND in Pandora/Linchpin. That's why some of his reaction seems a bit overblown now. Beckett has clear, albeit spaced out signals of her interest and care for Castle that he did witness. (Won't get into what he didn't witness that the audience didn't) so his not questioning it all along seems off as he's usually so observant - especially of Beckett. Then he jumps to this crazy conclusion.
I can see why people has Castle has been out of character, but I think it has more to do with the pace of his realizations. They wanted to hold him back a bit, or maybe they ran out of space in certain episodes, but it definitely added an element of annoyance for me this season. Like even though I hated Josh and some of that stuff was PAINFUL to watch, IMO, the overall pace of the season 3 story arc was alot better in flow and the dots were much better connected in terms of what was going on with Beckett and Castle.

Beckstle wrote:

My biggest problem with this season hasn't been the story - it's been the pacing. The filler episodes really dragged. I think the issue between them would have been better served being addressed a bit in each episode. Like, Cuffed was cute, but it didn't address any of the reasons why there might be tension there - just the tease at the end about the handcuffs. At least that time Castle noticed it. That reaction Beckett has when Castle shows her how he pet the do - Castle basically DOESN'T react - he runs. Then there's her jealosuy in Beholder AND in Pandora/Linchpin. That's why some of his reaction seems a bit overblown now. Beckett has clear, albeit spaced out signals of her interest and care for Castle that he did witness. (Won't get into what he didn't witness that the audience didn't) so his not questioning it all along seems off as he's usually so observant - especially of Beckett. Then he jumps to this crazy conclusion.
I can see why people has Castle has been out of character, but I think it has more to do with the pace of his realizations. They wanted to hold him back a bit, or maybe they ran out of space in certain episodes, but it definitely added an element of annoyance for me this season. Like even though I hated Josh and some of that stuff was PAINFUL to watch, IMO, the overall pace of the season 3 story arc was alot better in flow and the dots were much better connected in terms of what was going on with Beckett and Castle.

And don't forget the expression on her face when Castle said he had a plus one and describing her in detail, the relief on her face when he said it was Alexis was hilarious, they should have a shot of Esposito shaking his head or something.

DEX

Yes, that also. It does seem that this season Castle has been a bit...dense. That's what was good about Slaughter's ch Varacter in HeadHunters. Slaughter was an obnoxious jerk, but also reminded Castle that when you want something YOU GO AFTER IT. Castle has not done that. Saying I love you when someone is bleeding out in your arms is not the same as going after a relationship...on the other hand, it also points to a level of insecurity that Castle has in...being a guy. It speaks a bit to his lack of male role models in his life. I'm not saying the character isn't masculine, but he hasn't had that kind of guidance in his life growing up...in some ways he THINKS like a woman. So...while it does seem to be out of character and annoying, on another level it fits. Especially if they are getting ready to move into the issue of Castle's dad... Still, I think the pacing and build of realizations could have been tighter and better ordered.

Beckstle wrote:

Yes, that also. It does seem that this season Castle has been a bit...dense. That's what was good about Slaughter's ch Varacter in HeadHunters. Slaughter was an obnoxious jerk, but also reminded Castle that when you want something YOU GO AFTER IT. Castle has not done that. Saying I love you when someone is bleeding out in your arms is not the same as going after a relationship...on the other hand, it also points to a level of insecurity that Castle has in...being a guy. It speaks a bit to his lack of male role models in his life. I'm not saying the character isn't masculine, but he hasn't had that kind of guidance in his life growing up...in some ways he THINKS like a woman. So...while it does seem to be out of character and annoying, on another level it fits. Especially if they are getting ready to move into the issue of Castle's dad... Still, I think the pacing and build of realizations could have been tighter and better ordered.

But you look at it from Castle's perspective and from past behaviour. He has ALWAYS *cough* been respectful of Beckett and not forcing the issue. Remember from the season 3 finale. He wanted her to be happy and that she should think about Josh. Beckett's the one who doesn't know what the hell she wants. Castle knows what he wants, but he's not going to disrespect Beckett and her relationships.

You call it "dense", I call it a man wanting to keep in contact with someone he cares about, while also being made to hang around because other powers that be want him to stay around.

From the season 4 opener, Kate told him to wait. So he's waiting and respecting her wishes.

The burden of going "after" a relationship falls squarely on Beckett, one complex, multilayered character that is very difficul to understand.

From the pilot, Castle asked her out on a date already, she turned him down.

End of season 2, Castle gave up and decided to hook up with his ex BECAUSE he saw that she finally found someone that made her happy and he had thought she really didn't need him around.

A man can only take so much before giving up.

But to the original question of pacing and storyline, Beckett has for this season been about healing and recovery and she has not entered into any relationships or dates. Castle on the other hand has to deal with "muses" from past and present which forces Beckett to start removing that wall and after the girl talk ep, finally confronts and decides to go for it....unfortunately for her, wrong timing.

DEX

DexterTan76 wrote:

Beckstle wrote:

Yes, that also. It does seem that this season Castle has been a bit...dense. That's what was good about Slaughter's ch Varacter in HeadHunters. Slaughter was an obnoxious jerk, but also reminded Castle that when you want something YOU GO AFTER IT. Castle has not done that. Saying I love you when someone is bleeding out in your arms is not the same as going after a relationship...on the other hand, it also points to a level of insecurity that Castle has in...being a guy. It speaks a bit to his lack of male role models in his life. I'm not saying the character isn't masculine, but he hasn't had that kind of guidance in his life growing up...in some ways he THINKS like a woman. So...while it does seem to be out of character and annoying, on another level it fits. Especially if they are getting ready to move into the issue of Castle's dad... Still, I think the pacing and build of realizations could have been tighter and better ordered.

But you look at it from Castle's perspective and from past behaviour. He has ALWAYS *cough* been respectful of Beckett and not forcing the issue. Remember from the season 3 finale. He wanted her to be happy and that she should think about Josh. Beckett's the one who doesn't know what the hell she wants. Castle knows what he wants, but he's not going to disrespect Beckett and her relationships.

You call it "dense", I call it a man wanting to keep in contact with someone he cares about, while also being made to hang around because other powers that be want him to stay around.

From the season 4 opener, Kate told him to wait. So he's waiting and respecting her wishes.

The burden of going "after" a relationship falls squarely on Beckett, one complex, multilayered character that is very difficul to understand.

From the pilot, Castle asked her out on a date already, she turned him down.

End of season 2, Castle gave up and decided to hook up with his ex BECAUSE he saw that she finally found someone that made her happy and he had thought she really didn't need him around.

A man can only take so much before giving up.

But to the original question of pacing and storyline, Beckett has for this season been about healing and recovery and she has not entered into any relationships or dates. Castle on the other hand has to deal with "muses" from past and present which forces Beckett to start removing that wall and after the girl talk ep, finally confronts and decides to go for it....unfortunately for her, wrong timing.

DEX

It's interesting hearing a guy's take. Here's what I think Beckett's view was:

Castle THE PLAYBOY asked her out on date. The page six, bed-hopping famous writer. The Castle of season 1 was not in love with Beckett. Intrigued, and hot for her, sure. But equating THAT with some grand gesture is, from a woman's perspective, ridiculous. YEAH, he's attractive, and it might be fun, AND he probably made the same offer to 10 other girls that night. Kate had NO reason to take Castle seriously at ALL for most of season 1. In season 2, she watches Castle fall into bed with some actress using him to try and get a movie role. At THAT POINT, letting herself think seriously about Castle as a romantic partner again becomes a "What was I thinking" moment. So when Demmings walks in... Remember, Beckett has always been clear she's a "one and done" kind of girl. Castle has never expressed that's what he's looking for.

WE know what Castle is thinking, but BECKETT doesn't. So when he invites her to the Hamptons, SHE DOESN'T KNOW what it means to him. She knows she and Castle flirt, care deeply about each other as friends, and that what she feels for him is more than what she feels about Demmings, but it's Javier who has to point out to her than Castle must be feeling someone special about her since he's stuck around so long. She REALLY didn't put that together, and that really rings true as a woman. Like, we're friends, but it doesn't mean he thinks I'm special like THAT. But, she decides to risk it. Decides the man she's come to know - and could possibly be falling for is worth the risk. Only when she does, he's already moved on from the idea of her, proving TO HER that obviously Javier was wrong. Things were ma made worse because he didn't even call, because he was too busy with his ex-wife/girlfriend in the Hamtons. Ouch.

What is SO painful to watch in Castle is knowing how both sides are feeling, and realizing neither hs ANY IDEA what's going on with the other. Rick Castle has a distinct DISADVANTAGE in trying to pursue a rrelationship with Beckett - his very public, colorful, playboy past. For a woman like Beckett and what she wants from a relationship itms a HUGE risk, and why I think Andrew had her cling SO hard to the relationship with Josh, even as she knows that her heart really belongs to Castle. Season 3 is where I think Beckett realized she LOVED Castle and the letter her trainer left her (again a GUY) points out that that HE can see the feelings are mutual. Then all hell breaks loose, she gets shot in the chest and as she lay possibly dying Castle tells her he loves her. She hears it and smiles because it's what she's wanted/ needed to know, but it's still problematic. Still, it's enough for her to want to pull herself together enough to attempt having a romantic relationship.

It's so interesting that you don't see Castle's past actions and history. As having any bearing on how Beckett reacts to him, because to me it's the crux of all her hesitation. In terms of Castle being respectful, yes, I agree he is. However, his experience is that women go AFTER him. He's a catch, attractive. It's really hard to believe a guy like that is serious about a relationship. Lanie's comment about the blond bimbos Castle hadn't been doing for a while also points out that he HAD been, at some point, still doing that while working with Beckett. This is why I REALLY hated Beholder. It sets the sense of Castle's focus back. I know, he's not a monk, but it sets up that whole spin about his past and attention span - AGAIN. Beckett doesn't fight it because she knows she's in no position to be in a relationship with him at that point, but also, HE IS WHO HE IS, and she's not gonna change him.

In a nice mirror reversal, it takes another woman to inform Castle that he's IN a relationship with Beckett, unspoken as it is. They are each other's "one and done."

Yet Castle can't seem to take ownership of that. What I liked about the end of HeadHunters was that Castle was asking himself if he was really all in. Despite being hurt is she what he really, really wants, no matter what. There is a difference between being respecful and being passive. Early this season Castle said he was gonna help Kate bring down those walls, but he never actually does that. That's why I said his reaction is more feminine. It's like he's been waiting for Kate to make a move on him so he's sure she likes him, rather than declaring, Hey, I AM waiting for you. I mean, hears the thing, he's believed Kate didn't hear him, right? He DOESN'T repeat it. If Kate REALLY hadn't heard him, and had that conversation on the swings with him why doesn't he say he's hopingthe kind of relationship she wants could be with him. He continues to act as a good loving friend, which,if not for the fact Kate HAD heard him, would have put her back as being disappointed again.

Now I'm NOT saying Kate has no responsibility, because she does. She HAS to tell him that she heard him, and what it meant to her, and what it motivated her to do. She OWES HIM THAT, even if she finds out he's moved on, or worse didn't really mean it (again, we know he did, but for her there's always the possibility that is was BECAUSE he thought she was dying.) However, she hasn't been a position where she could do anything about it. She IS strong enough now, she's gone and done the heavylifting of working on herself so she can, yes, go after, having a romantic relationship with Castle. It's probably the first time they've ever been on the same page at the same time, both with RISKS they'll have to take in order to have what they want.

What is really clear about all this. Men are from Mars, women are from Venus, and there REALLy needs to be better manuals on how thy think and operate. Communication issues, completely different ways of looking at the exact same situation...no wonder it's taken this long to even BE on the same page!

From Beckett's perspective, when it comes to romantic relationships Castle HASN'T changed. He just got his head turned around by some Hollywood chick wanting a part in his movie! . She doesn't want to lose Castle in her LIFE, but YES she IS putting up a wall. She's not a rebound, she's "knows" Castle can't be right for her - because she's a one and done kind of girl. Demming is perfect on paper for her and Castle....isn't (on paper. We know better, she doesn't)
Again, so funny. Yes, he's changed, proven he's an AMAZING friend and person, but as her boyfriend? The traits that have always concerned her have NOT changed, and it's her biggest concern. Still, "The HEART WANTS WHAT IT WANTS. She's wrestling with wanting Rick even as wrestles with it being even feasible. She has NO IDEA the turmoil Rick's been in. They are BOTH wrestling with their feelings for each separately and don't talk to each other about it. BLoved the fight they had in the season 3 finale because they were FINALLy directly talking about the frustrations they'd been :laug feeling! Then the damn sniper.... That Marlowe!

I really think there will be some major Caskett movement by the finale. I can't believe he'd go through all of this without a big emotional payoff in the season.

I was going to bring that up - the argument they had in Beckett's apartment.


And finally Castle stepped up and told her off - great lines.

"And what about you?"
"Of course I don't want anything to happen to you! I'm your partner! I'm your Friend!"
"Is that what we are?"

Almost accusing. Good on Castle for telling her off and as an aside he told her what
he's always wanted as someone who cares for her.

"You could be happy, you deserve to be happy!"

Also love the whole "I want him out!" to Montgomery and when he said "Okay" she was
like "What!" Ah Kate, a contradiction in what you want and say! I'm sure Castle will be
very scared at any "tests" she puts on him if they get together.

What I loved about that moment is that it was clear NEITHER of them had a clue! She wants him to step up because she DOESN'T KNOW what he really wants from her - any more than he knows what she wants from him. They are BOTH so mad at the confusion it creates for them. Castle sees her as holding back, but she has had no sense that HE wants something SERIOUS with her. "I've been hanging with the school's funniesst kid" - so I DON'T KNOW what you want from me or how you really feel about me. He's says, "we kiss and we don't talk about it. Nope, NEITHER did. They BOTH had been hiding, keeping the other in the dark. For me it showed how they both had screwed up, but what it also DOES is show to the other that clearly that other WANTS something more, which is info that was NOT clear before that point. Of course, in the moment they are both WAY to mad to see that, but FINALLY some real thoughts and feelings about the other person are revealed. GREAT scene.

If you look at a single event that shows Castle wants something serious from Kate, it would be the "Hotel" scene in Los Angeles.

She walks away, but then changes her mind and then Castle thinks, nope, she's not ready.

Of course from a Male perspective, Beckett has WAY too much emotional baggage.

Castle on the other hand, being older and has had more "serious" relationships but is grounded by his family.

But he can't figure out Beckett.

To me, Castle wants something to happen, but Kate has not always been available and he's too much of a gentleman (or as you put it, too much of a pussy) to put his foot down and say "Make up your mind now!".

Because well, it IS complicated because he can't "move on" if she rejects him due to the fact he's there to stop her from investigating her mum's murder.

Talk about putting the cards on the table, Beckett is the river card.

It will be a very interesting season finale.

I'm sure there'll be a riot on twitter if Marlowe doesn't get these two crazy kids together.

PS.

Curious is there a fave quotes/scene/you tube section on here somewhere? I'd post a couple of faves

My gosh, I love someone who actuall wants to tALK about this stuff! I am SO HAPPY!

Incidently...I DON'T think Castle has been a "pussy" - especially through season 3. I don't think he really KNEW exactly WHAT he wanted with Kate until season two. I felt he starrted realizing it was way deeper than attraction or admiration or "musery." So I don't BLAME him. THAT's what was painful, him figuring it out, but in the meantime his actions have sent Kate to Demmings. He's crushed, she has no idea. Then Javier clues her in, Kate takes that sudden risk, but Castle's crushed and seeks comfort in his ex. SO not a pussy, just HORRIBLE timing! When he comes BACK is when he realizes it. HAS to be Kate, but she's now clinging to Josh. SHE has no idea that Castle has had this revealation, so even as she's falling for Castle all over again she is trying not too.

That Hotel scene was intense! The fact that it pushed her to almost cheat really blew me away. It told me just how much it really is about Castle for her and how hard she has to have been fighting it.

So yes, I do think at THAT point she knows & believes Castle feels something real for her, and then she's stuck, because she is with Josh, and Josh is "safe" and what if it was just the moment...yadda, yadda, yadda in other words a total girl (see I DON'T blame Castle for everything

After Dead Pool, if the stuff with Lockwood hadn't gone down...but as you said it'd be a different show.

My only issues with Castle stepping up a bit has really been in this season. That scene in Embarrassment of bitches when he just walks out? What WAS that? That made NO SENSE to me.

Ah yes, the dog episode.

Remember, Beckett told him to wait (all in subtext of course ) and there was even a slight catch in her voice when he was doing the hand thing. Castle would have heard it as "No Castle, I'm not ready for that yet...), so he just ran so it wouldn't make her uncomfortable. Although saying "I'll miss you - the dog, not you" didn't help much

I just want to see Beckett's reaction when she finds out Castle overheard her "confession" about remembering everything.

After all Stana is probably one of the best "reactors" whether it be subtle or over the top in face expressions.

Also, with all the shots taken at Nathan Fillion and his weight gain, I wonder if they'll insert an injoke in season 5 about it. Should be Ryan or Esposito saying something like "Have you lost weight?"

That is if Nathan has that kind of sense of humour.

If (WHEN) these two get together in the finale, season 5 opens up with so many storyline possibilities and there's still the back story to Gates, future plans of Alexis and what Eposito and Lanie are going to do. Also are Caskett going to tell everyone they are dating or keep it on the down low or will they be separated by something that they know how each feels about the other but they can't do anything about it.

DEX

Oh, I am definitely looking forward to seeing how Stana handles Beckett's realizations!

I've said alot on Twitter that I don't see it as either character's "fault." They are both such strong, flawed, well written characters. When I read what you said about "Rick would have heard it as..." it really reminded me that Kate isn't the only one in need of therapy. Rick has his own insercurties, his own sense of NOT being enough of himself. It's been a BIG deal for him to be accepted by these "regular guys" at the 12th....

Which brings me back to Slaughter. Slaughter is a jerk, an extreme, over the top, my way or the highway, arrogant kind of guy. Machismo Idiotoso personified. But going with Slaughter things WAY to much of himself, Castle seems to think TOO LITTLE of himself and hence doesn't see what's obvious in Kate's response. Should he have tried to kiss her - NO. But he SAYS nothing, asks nothing, does nothing. How does that fit with his pledge to help Kate bring those walls down when he just walks away from Beckett's huge, dark, "I am SO turned on and in shock because it's just a touch" eyes? <sigh>

Yeah. I can't WAIT till Caskett happens and they can start talking about and working on their issues TOGETHER. I'm wondering too how they're gonna play it. I HOPE it's not "we know how we feel but can't do anything about it right now."

I like the idea of sometime more complex. Maybe they talk and the secrets come out and they are both hurt and angry...and aware that each did it out of love and that they ARE in love....that they realize they have to try and make it work, and work through the trust issues, the stuff with her mom's murder, his dad and his past. Like, they get together not because everything is resolved between them, but rather itMs more painful and detrimental for them NOT to be together and work it out. One thing Beheaded really nailed home is that on ALL levels these are two people who are better together than apart - flaws and all.

GOD, I LOVE THIS SHOW!!!